Thread: Elliott Wave Trading Discussion

Originally Posted by justy10125

No, it means I'm saying robert miner's application of EW is sloppy. That doesn't mean that the people who read his book apply EW in the exact same way. There is no correlation to Miner and Cmellon.

I'm done with this conversation. If you'd like to talk about something real that has to do with EW, then that's great. Otherwise, I'm done sending the same comments back and forth.

Justy,

I still think your original comment was the clearest definition of the theory of EW and it's application in real time trading.

Originally Posted by mike3gdc

they all become one! I had this aha moment while ago that
"I thought in order to become a super trader,like the Market Wizards I must learn and master Money Management,then when I started reading books in position sizing and MM then like ilovepipin,said still was losing and I was in red THEN i had another aha moment! that I shoud also learn and MASTER the Elliott Wave Principle!

You are correct. MM is most important no matter your trading system.
You don't need to know everything about the market to be a good trader. Most profitable traders only win 30% of their trades.
Psychology is very important. You cannot take your losses personally.
We have an emotional system that can physically hurt us in order to protect us from pain. (Yeah, sounds crazy) but that emotion sets in when we take losses personal. The market does what it wants, it can do anything it wants and it is always right. You just have to go with the market and not try to force your opinion. Because then, if it goes the other way, you get hurt and fear comes in.

The 3 charts are all INDU charts.

It is interesting to watch the volume and its divergence with price action.
It seems that the downturn in the current correction wave already started. Perhaps we will see a last breath of life, small upwave but it should be shortlived.

Now, how to use the correct timing to make some nice pips in forex markets? Do you think relation will be 1 to 1? Or will we see some sort of lagging here?

Sorry QSX, I made confusion with your eur/usd short position, my mistake!

I'm in office in this moment and ... yes, we have a bloomberg terminal!

Very intresting your blog!

Originally Posted by qsx

no, only two positions open right now.

==

:: 01.09.2009 :: 19:00 :: eurchf ::

buy @ 1,516 :: stop 1,056 (-100 pips INITIAL) :: target > 1,55

result :: **currently open** (stop_1 @ -100)


:: 03.09.2009 :: 09:47:: eurusd::

sell @ 1,4300 :: stop 1,4450 (-150 pips INITIAL) :: target < 1,30 LONG TERM

result :: **currently open** (stop_1 @ -150)

==

you have a bloomberg terminal?

Good mornig , Sean

Whats going on with the Usd Yen pair this morning ?

Do you have any chart comments ? ............. thanx

Trade setup.

Based upon this count buy 3 units at 50% retrace of wave a of b.
Stop at top of wave a, target upper trendline of trading channel. (195 pips)

If price goes the other way, limit order beneath the stop, 6 units target 4200.
(180 pips) Risk: 30 pips.

There you go, wrong about my count right about my trade.
Loss 3x30 pips = 90 pips.
Gain 6x30 pips = 180 pips total gain 90 pips.

Originally Posted by mike3gdc

marketwaves,thank you for your chart.It's all sorted out now...Best

hi mike


may be that help you

Originally Posted by qsx

your wave 2 goes below the origin of wave 1, which means there is something differnt going on..
the idea of a impulse is that it signals a CHANGE IN TREND (crowd behaviour, sentiment extreme), if price goes below the initial impulse (or what you suspect to be one) then no change in trend has occured, and you are still in a series of lower lows.
therefore it cannot be a 1-2-3-4-5 structure.

Thank you Lacho...

original elliot wave is not a trading system by any means ....

and it's not some magical conspiracy that moving averages are systems but EW is not .... no .... it is because original EW, when applied to real-time (or even history for that matter), is not consistent (ever wondered why there is always an up-count and a down-count at the same time with EW?)

why? because there aren't nearly enough rules for such a complex task as counting all the intricacies of market behavior

pure elliot wave with those few rules that elliot presented and that prechter rehashed is too loose to be consistent, and therefore, is not and cannot be a trading system as it stands


note: elliot himself never made money consistently using EW

Originally Posted by marketwavez2

Good mornig , Sean

Whats going on with the Usd Yen pair this morning ?

Do you have any chart comments ? ............. thanx

Morning, marketwavez...sorry I wasn't here earlier. Was teaching a class on NFP. Back on the boards now.

Here are my thoughts on the USD/JPY. There's a wedge chart pattern. While one of the tougher chart patterns to predict in my opinion...here are two, very common outcomes from this pattern.

See what you guys think.

Originally Posted by zeev

original elliot wave is not a trading system by any means ....

and it's not some magical conspiracy that moving averages are systems but EW is not .... no .... it is because original EW, when applied to real-time (or even history for that matter), is not consistent (ever wondered why there is always an up-count and a down-count at the same time with EW?)

why? because there aren't nearly enough rules for such a complex task as counting all the intricacies of market behavior

pure elliot wave with those few rules that elliot presented and that prechter rehashed is too loose to be consistent, and therefore, is not and cannot be a trading system as it stands


note: elliot himself never made money consistently using EW

zeev, everyone here knows that while I'm an expert in a lot of areas of technicals/fundamentals...I'm not in Elliott Wave, by any stretch of the imagination.

With that said, to me...Elliott Wave gives the trader a much needed "edge". If you take that edge and couple it with good risk management, then you've got a great system. Those are two of the biggest keys to any system or methodology.

In the end, there will be a wave count that will be the correct one. However, while it's all in the process of forming, there's some studying that needs to be done to determine which pattern it is that is unfolding.

Those are "my two cents" but I'd love to hear from the "truly" seasoned Elliott Wavers on here.

I know I'm a firm believer in EW.

I can see a lot of talking today in in the forum.

Justy or Iloveppin, could you confirm if this is the one you would call for expanding ending triangle ?

Originally Posted by Sean Hyman

zeev, everyone here knows that while I'm an expert in a lot of areas of technicals/fundamentals...I'm not in Elliott Wave, by any stretch of the imagination.

With that said, to me...Elliott Wave gives the trader a much needed "edge". If you take that edge and couple it with good risk management, then you've got a great system. Those are two of the biggest keys to any system or methodology.

In the end, there will be a wave count that will be the correct one. However, while it's all in the process of forming, there's some studying that needs to be done to determine which pattern it is that is unfolding.

Those are "my two cents" but I'd love to hear from the "truly" seasoned Elliott Wavers on here.

I know I'm a firm believer in EW.

Listen, I've been studying and trading EW for 4 years. Prechter's EW is a joke for trading, it gives you absolutely no edge. All he does is identify that there's a 5-wave impulsive move followed by a 3-wave corrective. There is absolutely no hard and specific rules for the intricacies and characteristics of each specific wave in any scientific way for a repeated result. Prechter, whose book everyone here read, is a "socionomist" and goes into the psychology of waves. That's all. That's his addition to EW. He left Elliot's original work completely unchanged in terms of the technicalities of waves themselves. He went into psychology. He's a salesman and a psychologist.

And of those "seasoned ellioticions" you speak of, perhaps you were talking about marketwavez2, among some others. Well, from what I see from watching marketwavez's charts is he does not rely on EW at all pretty much. He identifies support/resistance, knows some reliable chart patterns, and only then as a brush-up adds some labels. It is more a cosmetic job than anything else. Never did I see him label a chart purely relying on EW.

And about your belief in EW. We all believe in EW to some extent or other. Anyhow, once you start putting real capital on the line based on your EW counts, then you'll see what I'm talking about... Good luck.

Originally Posted by Sean Hyman

With that said, to me...Elliott Wave gives the trader a much needed "edge". If you take that edge and couple it with good risk management, then you've got a great system. Those are two of the biggest keys to any system or methodology.

Thank you!
I gave a live example this morning. A count and a trade setup. Count was wrong trade was profitable. I cannot make my point any clearer.

EW ultimately is used to win trades, weather you are right or wrong about your count. It provides great what/if scenario's. At certain points in the market you cannot go wrong if you apply it correctly.

The book: "Key to market behaviour" is an analysis book. It does not teach you how to trade. Does not provide entry, exits or stops.
That does not mean EW cannot be applied as a trading system. It can, I proved it this morning, 90 pips here to prove it.

Anyway, I am letting this rest now. People are free to apply EW in any way they choose, and I am okay with that.

Originally Posted by zeev

Listen, I've been studying and trading EW for 4 years. Prechter's EW is a joke for trading, it gives you absolutely no edge. All he does is identify that there's a 5-wave impulsive move followed by a 3-wave corrective. There is absolutely no hard and specific rules for the intricacies and characteristics of each specific wave in any scientific way for a repeated result. Prechter, whose book everyone here read, is a "socionomist" and goes into the psychology of waves. That's all. That's his addition to EW. He left Elliot's original work completely unchanged in terms of the technicalities of waves themselves. He went into psychology. He's a salesman and a psychologist.

And of those "seasoned ellioticions" you speak of, perhaps you were talking about marketwavez2, among some others. Well, from what I see from watching marketwavez's charts is he does not rely on EW at all pretty much. He identifies support/resistance, knows some reliable chart patterns, and only then as a brush-up adds some labels. It is more a cosmetic job than anything else. Never did I see him label a chart purely relying on EW.

And about your belief in EW. We all believe in EW to some extent or other. Anyhow, once you start putting real capital on the line based on your EW counts, then you'll see what I'm talking about... Good luck.

I have too many friends that I personally know of that are profitable based off of their Elliott Wave counts. My personal profitability has come from other areas (combo of fundamentals/technicals). However, by their live trading statements, I can see that it's valid. And they are "strict Elliott Wavers" as far as that being the main thing they look at for their trading decisions.